February 2026 Bonus

In this bonus episode of the Reading Teachers Lounge, Shannon and Mary chat with longtime listener Andrea McCarty, a first-grade teacher with 28 years of experience in southwest Washington. Andrea shares her journey from guided reading and Marie Clay's influences to a strong focus on explicit, systematic phonics, spelling through dictation, and structured literacy practices.

Andrea discusses how analyzing student outcomes led her team to pursue deeper diagnostics, clearer scope-and-sequence planning, and new instructional approaches, including LETRS, UFLI, and resources from experts like Heidi Mesmer, Wiley Blevins, and Allison Ryan. Andrea also reflects on adapting instruction during COVID and the impact of strong collaboration and administrative support.

The conversation highlights practical strategies for supporting vocabulary and comprehension with decodables, teaching high-frequency words, integrating morphology, structuring an effective literacy block, and maintaining student engagement—along with Andrea’s advice to keep evolving, stay collaborative, and focus on what brings joy to teaching.

00:00 Welcome to the Reading Teachers Lounge 
00:26 + Meet Andrea McCarty
02:26 Early Career & Looping Multi-Age Classrooms (K–6 Wings)
04:25 What Sparked the Literacy Deep Dive:
05:34 McCracken Dictation & Why Spelling-to-Reading Matters
07:05 Words Their Way, Guided Reading, and the ‘Something’s Missing’ Feeling
10:38 A Turning Point: 
11:53 Piloting a Phonics Program… Then COVID Hits
12:25 Science of Reading Wake-Up Call
14:01 Back to Class
17:16 Switching to UFLI: What’s Great and What Needs Supplementing
19:28 Supporting MLL/ELL Students with Decodables: 
24:16 Pacing for Mastery + Teamwide Scope & Sequence Conversations
27:46 Structured Word Inquiry in the Wild
31:35 Current Challenges
32:56 Keeping Engagement High
33:24 Inside the Literacy Block
35:33 Must-Do/May-Do + Small Groups
37:32 Supplementing Curriculum 
38:48 Practice Turns = Progress
42:09 Long Vowels Next
47:29 What Teachers Need Most
55:44 Building a True PLC
01:02:00 Closing Reflections

RESOURCES REFERENCED IN OUR DISCUSSION:

1. UFLI 
2. Reading Universe
3. Project Read
4. Secret Stories
5. Spelling Through Phonics by The McCrackens *Amazon affiliate link 
6. The High Frequency Word Project
7. UFLI lesson videos
8. Alison Ryan (Learning at the Primary Pond)
9. From Sounds to Spelling
10. Letter Lessons and First Words: Phonics Foundations That Work by Nell K. Duke and Heidi Ann Mesmer *Amazon affiliate link

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Transcript

February 2026 Bonus with Andrea McCarty

Shannon Betts: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Reading Teachers Lounge. These are our bonus episodes where we're in conversation with teachers in the field, and we are so excited to welcome a longtime podcast listener to the podcast and into the Reading Teachers Lounge, Andrea McCarty, who we've corresponded with behind the scenes many times over the years that now we're finally meeting virtually, at least on Zoom.

So welcome to the Teachers Lounge. Andrea, 

Andrea McCarty: thank you so much. I'm really excited to be here. 

Shannon Betts: Tell us where you're coming from and then tell us a little bit about the work you do with literacy. 

Andrea McCarty: Sure. I live in Washington state, so we're as far apart right now as we could probably get geographically.

But I live in southwest Washington and I teach in a small-ish district just across the river from Portland, Oregon, to give you a little reference. But I am in Washington. I've been teaching for 28 years, most of that time in the same building actually, and in the same grade level. I've been lucky enough to do that.

I teach at an amazing school with [00:01:00] teachers that have been there almost as long as I have as well. My career has taken a few bends and turns as I've dabbled in a few opportunities of. Leadership just while staying in the classroom, which I think is unique in my district, that you can have opportunities to be still a classroom teacher in the trenches, but have some coaching pathways or leadership pathways to help bridge that district to building gap that we all sometimes feel.

And I would say I have never had one year that's the same as the other. And I think that's why I love teaching so much. I am constantly refining my craft and that's what I really love about teaching is the opportunity to keep growing. But it's the people I work with and the kids, you know, that's what keeps me.

It drives you crazy sometimes, but it's also what keeps you where you are. I don't think I'm better than any teacher in my building. We're just in it together. And I have appreciated the leadership [00:02:00] at my building that we had for the same principal for 17 years, which is pretty unheard of. And so we're in a little bit of a change right now in our district with some budget issues and low enrollment and a lot of administrator changes due to budget issues.

But right now, first grade is where I'm supposed to be and I, I really love it. 

Shannon Betts: Is that where most of your teaching years have been? Is it first grade? 

Andrea McCarty: Yeah. I actually, when I first got hired, I worked in a very large district up near the Seattle area and at that time in 1996, so that's gonna date me it was multi grade level teaching.

So our whole building where I first started teaching was multi-age. And the idea behind that was they had received a grant to try to see if school attendance would increase, if kids had the same teachers. So each wing in our building was a K six wing, and you would keep your kids for two years, you would multi-age loop [00:03:00] with them.

And it was a really low income school and it was a very interesting time to start teaching because they just. Point blank told you we do not hire first year teachers. And there were two of us that got hired. And so it was a little intimidating, but I learned a lot from those veteran teachers. And then my husband and I relocated to southwest Washington and I taught in the very district that I said, I will not get a job in that district because I grew up near there.

I don't wanna work there. And then that's where I ended up and worked at one school and then opened a brand new school, which is weird to say because that was 24 years ago. So I've been in the same building since in first grade. Yeah. 

Mary Saghafi: What, what a nice trajectory that you've had. 'cause it's, it feels a little familiar.

So my mom was also a teacher and there's a lot of teachers in our family but she was in similar buildings for such a long time and mm-hmm. It creates this really unique continuity that I don't see [00:04:00] existing kind of at this time. And I think that your school might be a little bit unique in that that you have kept a lot of teachers, but it is so special when that happens because you get to know families and siblings as they come along.

Mm-hmm. That is really tremendous. I'm so glad to meet you. Thank you. You have so much to share, and when we correspond, it's usually kind of questions about, you know, reading practices and best things like that. So I would love to know just a little bit, like what led you to become a reading teacher, or at least, you know, literally literacy focused.

Because I know that you're, you're teaching all subjects as a first grade teacher, but yeah. Let us know a little bit about you. 

Shannon Betts: Yeah. You're wearing a reading themed t-shirt. Yeah. So we know that you are passionate about literacy, like what you are. 

Andrea McCarty: I am for sure. And I love to just nerd out on it because it's fun and it's fun to talk to people that a, are as excited because then you just have this ongoing, I'm sure like you guys, like in your introduction, it's just, you can't stop [00:05:00] talking about it when you find those people you can talk with.

It's so fun. So I I taught really second, third grade and then I was curious like how, how are they learning to, why are some kids coming to second and third grade reading and some aren't? I'm curious about that. And the building that I had moved to. There was a first grade teacher who became really my, my work person and her name was also Andrea, and she said, come teach first grade with me and we can learn together.

And I just love that she said we could learn together, even though to me she seemed like she knew it all. And so what I had brought, and I still have, this is probably my fourth copy of it, and I'm surprised nobody ever talks about it, but McCracken dictation. Did you guys ever hear of McCracken dictation?

You'll have to look it up. 

Mary Saghafi: I had a rockstar teacher who I also co like co-taught with, and she introduced me to that book when we just. We, we hadn't even started our OG training. Mm-hmm. But she was teaching me about dictation. [00:06:00] I had never had any training in how important dictation is for students.

Dictation being that you teach them a phonics rule, that you have them spell the words. Then you don't have to give them a specific list of words, but the words that you're giving them have that similar phonics rule. After you do this kind of spelling test, quote unquote, then you incorporate those words into dictation sentences, and that is where the rubber meets the road.

Would you? Right. Do you agree with that? 

Andrea McCarty: Yes. So in McCracken spelling through dictation, we were really talking about hearing sounds at the beginning and end of words. So, in my mind, I was always teaching phonics, and this was a whiteboard. Like I remember one of the veteran teachers I worked with in my first building, you can teach anyone to read with a whiteboard and a.

I was like, okay, that's pretty basic. So I had this and I just would run it through the binding and wear it out and then buy another one. And so I [00:07:00] was doing that and then you start evolving a little bit. Like, well, that they're still getting kind of it, but not enough. So then we dabbled a lot inwards their way for a long time thinking this is the secret sauce, this, this will do it.

Just so much work. And then really, because I started teaching in 1996 and I moved to my current district in 99, that's when guided reading was really on the forefront. And again, I'm not quite figuring out how they're learning to read, but I have great classroom management. I worked in an affluent district.

Kids were reading, so what they were, they were doing enough. So I went and got my master's degree and my whole master's degree was really Marie Clay influenced and guided reading influenced. And here, you know, you pay all this money for. And you feel like, okay, now I'm going to totally know how kids learn to read.

And my teacher friend that I worked really closely with, we combined our classroom library and we spent [00:08:00] hours, days, weeks in the summer leveling our classroom library, but still like, we don't wanna level everything, so let's do some levels and let's do all the rest theme categories. And I'm really proud of that classroom library.

And I'll send you a picture because it still is the heart of my classroom, although it's not leveled anymore. But we were really I remember a dad ordering a set of books through a book order for his kid and coming in with that stack of books. And one of them was Arthur, remember the character Arthur Aardvark?

He's like, he can't read these. I don't know what to do. And then she and I, through those great conversations said, what if we start sending books home at their level and then we can help. Parents read with their kids so that they're successful, so they're not feeling the need to read Harry Potter, which no first grader could read or whatever the book was.

So we started sending home book bags every night, and we would help parents and it felt right because they could read at their [00:09:00] level at that time, but still had these kids that just in my classroom, in my heart of hearts, because you heard a little bit about dyslexia or learning disabilities, I thought, I am not serving them correctly, but I'm still trying my best.

I'm still gonna buy every book I'm gonna read. I'm gonna, I mean, the stack of books that I would buy that my colleagues and I would talk about, and we'd do book studies and there's still just that nagging, something's not quite right. And then I got a student teacher. When you get a student teacher, you really have to explain your routines and your practices.

And I remember saying to her. This is the district adopted curriculum for reading, but we do this, it's kind of undercover and we do this. And she, okay, she could do all that and follow the routines. And in the meantime, I'm still buying all these books. There's still gotta be the secret sign, 

Shannon Betts: okay, 

Andrea McCarty: Wiley Blevins, there's a scope and sequence.

Okay, okay, I can do that. [00:10:00] And then the rub of this is what the district is saying and I want to do right by that. But this is what I know is best for kids. And I would say with all of the tools I was using with my spelling through phonics dictation, with Words their Way, with all those things, I was spending so much time putting together, most of my kids were leaving as readers and there were that couple that I knew like they probably have a learning disability.

I don't know enough about that yet. I'm just gonna hope for the best and I'm going to send them to the next teacher that I know is a really good teacher and they'll get them on. Okay. So then I remember we were doing more data, looking at kids, moving on, and I remember seeing these kids in second and third grade see their names pop up and they were now receiving reading intervention and they thought, what is happening?

Those are my kids. I know. I taught them [00:11:00] what, why is this happening at second and third grade? And then that led us to, in our with our principal, she's like, well, let's find out. Let's do more diving. So then this book came out by Heidi Ann Mesmer, letter Lessons and first words. And I read this in the car on the way to one of my son's baseball tournaments.

And I just remember like. This is it. It was combining all the Wiley Blevins, all the scope and sequence doing diagnostic with them. I was so on fire for this. You could see I still have marked all my pages. So we met as a K one two team with our principal. And I remember getting these huge pieces of butcher paper out laying on the floor and writing out this scope and sequence and talking about, we're gonna take off grade level bands of K one, we're going to assess kids and see where they land.

We're going to do this. And at the same time, I had been following Allison Ryan with learning at the primary pond, and she was coming out [00:12:00] with her phonics program. And I was so excited about that. She put out an all call for people to apply to pilot the program. And I was like, please pick me. Please pick me.

Please pick me. And she did. And I was so excited to do this with my teachers. And then COVID hit. All of this went by the wayside. I mean, I even have it dated in my book and pre COVID. I had also bought, oh, I had listened to like everybody else, that podcast from Emily Hanford, and I was like, whatever. 

Mary Saghafi: Sold a story.

Mm-hmm. 

Andrea McCarty: Yep. I was actually in my closet, like putting clothes away and talking back to her over the podcast like, you are not in the classroom. You don't know. I'm already doing that. I do phonics, whatever. But it, that started nagging at me. Like, but what if, so then what's the book? I buy?

Mary Saghafi: [00:13:00] Language 

Andrea McCarty: AT the 

Mary Saghafi: Speed of Sight by Seidenberg. Very, very important. Yep. 

Andrea McCarty: But that is the hardest book to read. And I bought it. I, it was pre COVID. I bought it and I remember looking through it like, okay. Some of it makes sense, but the language is way too high. I'm just gonna set it over here with my big stack of books that I'll kind of get to and I'm still gonna dabble in some other things.

So anyway, COVID hit Allison Ryan was so supportive. Mary, I, or Shannon, I've been texting you about boom cards. That's when I first heard about boom cards and trying to dabble in a few of those really sequential practices over Zoom with kids and trying my best, but feeling like even one-on-one or in small group over Zoom, kids were reading and they were doing all the things.

With the help of Alice and Ryan, even online, they [00:14:00] were making growth. And we got kids back into our classroom really early. My, my former principal did a really good job of loosely interpreting the guidelines and getting kids in for small group for social emotional reasons. And so we'd have like four or five kids in our room for 90 minutes at a time.

And I'm like, come play this phonics game with me. Come do this quick dictation now, take this back home and practice with your parents. And it was actually working. But it was just slow because of the time being. However, when kids really got back into the classroom, I just dove in with Allison's program and they were making incredible growth.

It was so exciting. Got the kindergarten teachers on board, got the second grade teachers on board. We are small teams and like I said, we've worked together for a long time, so there's a lot of trust there. And then our principal had to share data and our kids at our school were growing [00:15:00] leaps and bounds.

And so one of the other principals came to my principal and said, 

Shannon Betts: whatcha really doing? 

Andrea McCarty: And people were asking us, what are you really doing? I'm like, we're doing spelling through phonics. We're doing this program. And it's not this big flashy program. It's $99 at the time. And it's so basic and good and it's got.

A scope and sequence. It's systematic, it's sequential. You go through like this, the routines are established every week, and the kids loved it. They were making growth. The teachers loved it because it was so explicit and it was just an awesome place to be. So we did that for a while and then our district invested in letters training, and that was fabulous.

I was telling Shannon Mary at the beginning that originally, well, sh Shannon, I didn't even say this part originally, it was just three of our six schools that got this training, [00:16:00] and then they did all six schools. And then our principal really pushed for our 3, 4, 5 teachers to get letter training as well.

So where our whole district in elementary is trained with letters over a course of, I believe three years. And this year we're all doing, you fly. So I had to give up some of the. Spelling through phonics, but I supplement a lot with that still, and now we're at the UFLI stage and I love it. It's really good.

Shannon Betts: Oh my goodness. I have so much. I took so many notes while you were talking.

Andrea McCarty: I know. I was talking, I wasn't stopping. 

Shannon Betts: No, and please do not apologize. That was all amazing. I just wanna tell you, you know, we're internet friends with Allison too, and she teases me so much about my crush on Wiley. Blevins. Like Uhhuh.

Andrea McCarty: Yeah. 

Shannon Betts: She's like, there's your dude. I know there's your dude Wiley. 

Andrea McCarty: I feel like if I can buy their books, then they're my friends. 

Shannon Betts: Yes. 

Andrea McCarty: So, yes. 

Shannon Betts: I mean, when we finally met him for the [00:17:00] podcast, 'cause I just tweeted him and then he responded and then I can't believe we've interviewed him twice and it's just like, we don't even, like, we have to just sort of get off the Zoom at some point because, you know, he has a really busy schedule.

But honestly, we could talk to him for like four or five hours on record and just pick his brain. 

Yes, 

Andrea McCarty: he's fine. 

Shannon Betts: But I wanna talk to you aboutUFLIy. I use UFLI as well with my tutoring students. And I, I've used it since it came out. You're probably in the Facebook group as well. Which I love that just Holly Lane, you know, would be there to answer the questions.

Andrea McCarty: Yes. 

Shannon Betts: Actually I will send you two. I spent just last weekend, I merged all the decodable files together in one so that I wouldn't have, 'cause I was printing like three different packets from the kindergarten, first grade, and then this supplemental, and now I've merged them into one PDF Oh. And so that I can like print it and like bind it and it's all in order.

So I'm gonna send that to you 'cause that took me like, like an over an hour to, to merge it all. But I love UFLI , but there are two things that I have to supplement with it. One you've probably heard last year on our [00:18:00] season that Mary and I both got trained in structured word inquiry. Mm-hmm. Just like you were talking about how like over the years they were just like, something's not quite right, something's missing.

Even when we were doing all these phonics things. We were like, something's not quite right in terms of vocabulary and like mm-hmm. Even like when our third and fourth and fifth graders were still need support, even though we felt like we had gotten them in strong decoders. Structured. Word inquiry is sort of the, the in teaching, you know, really strong morphology instruction has been like the answer to that.

Like, what's missing for us. And so what I've done to supplement UFLI is high frequency word project. Yeah. Yeah. They released a book this summer and it just has like all the sight words and I'm teaching the sight words. It's got like the etymology behind all the sight words. Mm-hmm. And so I am teaching the sight words kind of differently than that book or you fly.

Describe it like I'm following the scope and sequence of UFLI sight words. 'cause that's what's showing up in the decodables. But then I'm [00:19:00] grouping some of the words together like I'm teaching has and was and is. Mm-hmm. 

Mary Saghafi: At the same time. Yes. 

Shannon Betts: Because there's a reason they all have s at the end, you know, and so, and, and stuff like that.

And so I found those to be a really good pairing. Instead of just doing the heart words, because a lot of my students are needing the reason behind the heart and not just, oh, let me draw a heart behind it and memorize the part. They're not remembering the hard part without more of storytelling around the words.

The other thing that, with UFLI that's been bothering me, especially this year, is I've got two students that are English language learners. One is in fifth grade and one is in second grade. The fifth grader. It's not so hard to explain. Like she'll be like, what's the yak in the story? And I'm like, oh, yak is like a big mountain cow in the Himalayas, and I'll show her a picture.

And she's like, okay, got it. You know, because she has good oral language, but my second grader has hardly any English. And I mean, the decodables, you've got to see what we're doing. Like story seven, no story nine is the pen and the map, you know, a [00:20:00] pin uhhuh and a map and a pin is in the tin. And then I tap the map and I put the, to the pin in the map, and you're 

Andrea McCarty: like, what am I saying?

Shannon Betts: No, no, no. I literally had to have pull a push pin and a tin can, and I printed a map and then I put it on the bulletin board and we're tapping it, and we're pinning it, and I'm doing all the action with this kid, because he had no idea what that story was about. You know? Or like mm-hmm. There's a story about a pug and I'm showing him a picture online with what a pug dog is, or what's the difference between a hog and a pig, and what's a dog pen, and all of these things that are these decodable words, but.

He doesn't have the English vocabulary for it. Right. He knows the concept, but he doesn't have the English words for it. So I'm having to like almost create like a supplemental picture curriculum. 

Andrea McCarty: Mm-hmm. 

Shannon Betts: To go with all those words 

Andrea McCarty: somebody shared with me. It's a slide deck and it's each decodable lesson number.

Let's just, I'm gonna throw in a number 41 B. 

Shannon Betts: Yeah. 

Andrea McCarty: And it has [00:21:00] the vocabulary or the word and then a picture. It's very glad training. 

Shannon Betts: That's what I'm working, I'm working on making that myself. But if it already exists, 

Andrea McCarty: I'll share that with you. 

Shannon Betts: Thank you. 

Andrea McCarty: Because somebody shared that with me, so right there.

Shannon Betts: 'cause I'm even doing it with those dictation sentences too, you know? Mm-hmm. 

Andrea McCarty: Mm-hmm. 

Shannon Betts: And, and even the, you know, all the little words that they read in isolation or the word letters and the switch. A letter thing. Yeah. He, he just, he doesn't have any of the language. 

Andrea McCarty: Well, I've noticed when I get to the connected text Yeah.

And we've set up this routine. I, we were, I was talking to the kids. I bird walk a lot, hence the long. Conversation I just had of, well, I've been teaching for 28 years, so it's long. It's a long pathway. But like I've noticed that I've said to the kids, when you don't know what a word is, we have to talk about that.

But sometimes you don't know that you don't know. It's like they, they're six and seven, so they don't think about their thinking yet. Right. But I've noticed when we read that connected text, whether it's the sentence or the long decodable on the screen, they'll look at me now like, you're looking at me.[00:22:00] 

What does that mean? I think it means that you don't know what a word means, or I think you're looking at me because you're reading a sentence and you kind of don't understand it. And then you could see they're like, yeah, it's okay to say, I don't know what that word means, but they're not sophisticated enough to know that they don't even know what the word means.

Like we've had this conversation when you're defining a word, like, I don't know, well pin, let's just say pin or pin. If you can't tell or draw a picture of it, like a pin is a pin, you know it's a pin. And that's what first graders will say, well, it's just a pin, right? I, but could you draw a picture of it?

Or could you use another word for that? They need to be explicitly taught that and that as they read more words and we expose them to more words, it, it bird walks a little bit. But I think it's really important for them to have that opportunity to say, what does that mean? And some kids who are really curious will ask you, I don't.[00:23:00] 

I don't know what that means. Or your MLL students, you have to front load that because they're not gonna, they don't know what any of that means. Or it's in a different order than they might say it. So it's taking the lessons a little longer for me. 

Shannon Betts: Yeah, no, 

Andrea McCarty: it's me too have, 

Shannon Betts: I mean, I was on 17 and 19 for five different sessions, 

Andrea McCarty: Uhhuh, 

Shannon Betts: because that's story 17 was that one with like the big bug on the bus and all those names, like, and it was, it was really tough.

Anyway, 

Mary Saghafi: but we'll share too, 'cause I had a similar situation today and it was the word broil as in like you would heat something really high in the oven or maybe you would char broil something on the grill. And, yeah, my student did not know that word at all. He's a fifth grader. Mm-hmm. And he did not know how to ask me, and I was thinking about that too.

That that would be a word that I would anticipate that he would know. But then I thought about it like, I don't think he's ever had any experience grilling anything. I think I knew. This is funny too. You should think about why you [00:24:00] know that word. I think I knew that word because of old Burger King commercials.

Which is really funny, right. And so I don't think that he has ever heard a commercial like that before. And so, and you know, so I totally agree with you when you're trying to do that. The other piece that I was thinking, and this is my special ed piece coming through, is you need to go as fast as you can and as slow as you have to for mastery of lessons.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And that is something that I have learned along the way, but also has been shared with me. So you have to go as fast as possible, but also as slow as you need to in order to reach mastery. 

Andrea McCarty: So I I really, that's really good. That's, that makes me think of some conversations that, like in my building, our K teachers and our first grade teachers share a hallway.

So we naturally have these quick conversations and we share lunch together, and then second grade comes in. So we just have these natural opportunities to have [00:25:00] conversation and because we were. Flying so well doing from sounds to spelling, teachers were just, they were jazzed about it had every component that you needed and it felt so all encompassing that you weren't having to go find this book and this book and this book and create it and do all this.

Well, now that we've changed and branched over to, you fly and we're not a building that if it, if it's working, we're not gonna change it. But if it's not working, we're going to evolve it. So changing over to UFLI was like a big ask because I was kind of the one that started that with from sounds to spelling and people got on board and then they're changing to UFLI and they're like, I miss from sounds to spelling.

It had this, it had this, it had this component. And you guys have said this a lot too. There isn't one perfect scope and sequence, but you do have to use a scope and sequence. So I think what we learned when we were doing from sounds to spelling, all [00:26:00] of us in those three grade level bands, we now know where holes are for kids and we know where we need to supplement.

So Shannon, like you were saying, that irregular word routine. I know that kids need a little bit more based on who my students are. So we are supplementing now. And knowing where those good tools are, I know from sounds to spelling is gonna give me some of those tools that I need. I know that I can go to this place because I need a little bit more with the irregular word patterns that we're doing.

So I think that's the beauty of doing it with people across grade level, is that you can have those conversations. And take a risk like, I don't know, try it, what's gonna happen? Or let me know how that goes. You try that for a few weeks and then let me know how it's going with you. But that structured word inquiry podcast that you did.

I listened to it that morning. I got to school, I walked in with, at the time our reading teacher, and [00:27:00] she said our intervention specialist, I should say. She said, I'm going into fourth grade today to do structured word inquiry. I'm like, I just listened to the podcast. You have to listen to that. We ran to my room, we do a word up on the board together.

We practice this for her lesson. And it was, that's what I mean about your podcast. It's so applicable that what you're talking about. I can go use it right then in the classroom. And other people are listening too to say. Hey, I haven't gotten to that one yet, but I will. And they're talking about structured word inquiry.

Oh my goodness. Now I can give this to a fourth grade teacher who's dabbling in it and we can try it together. So I think it bridges some of the learning that we're doing into more practice that people can try and it gives them more words in conversation because you guys are talking about it too. 

Shannon Betts: Oh, I wanna hear, I would love to hear what your fourth grade colleague was doing with structured inquiry.

I'm using it a lot on my tutoring practice this year. I took a class this summer about. Using it in Canva, using Canva to do structured word [00:28:00] building. 

Andrea McCarty: Oh, interesting. 

Shannon Betts: And I have a a student, I've worked with her in fourth grade and now fifth grade this year. And she loves Canva. She is just a huge Canva visual learner mm-hmm.

Person. Mm-hmm. And so she's just having a really fun time doing those word sums and things like that. 

Andrea McCarty: That's so cool. Well, the person who was doing it, she, she's in her last year before retirement, and she's still perfecting her craft even in her last year because we're having dialogue across our building about it so people can, it's never too late, you know, to try those things.

Shannon Betts: That's cool. I'm kind of morphing. I, I ordered morpheme magic as a scope and sequence to use. Mm-hmm. But then I'm incorporating structured inquiry with the morpheme magic resources. 

Mary Saghafi: Well, and Shannon, that reminded me, before you, you know, when you were talking about how you were having difficulty with your UFLI, I'm wondering if you can have your student actually work on typing some of those simple sentences, using emoji icons or using Canva and then having them search for the picture and then [00:29:00] you coaching them through.

Why would this picture make most sense in this? You know, within the context because I think that it would be a really good use of technology and practice for that, but also then it would make more meaning if that student is searching for it on their own. 

Shannon Betts: I like that. And, and encouraging that curiosity, like Andrea was saying, where she's encouraging her students to ask for help and say, I don't know what this word means, rather than just immediately supplying it.

Mary Saghafi: Well, and I think it gives them the opportunity to know how they can also access. Searching words on their own and giving them sort of that permission to, to inquire on their own. And that reminded me of how you were using the structured word inquiry with your student. And I think that she has really taken that and owned it.

And, and now I don't think that she's worried or ashamed if she doesn't know that vocabulary word. She knows how to, you know, break it down. She knows how to search it. And I would assume that if somebody was doing it in [00:30:00] class, just knowing that student, she would likely raise her hand and, and teach that, which is meaning that she's come a really long way.

But you know, I think that that's the purpose of this, right? That's why we do what we do and we need to keep thinking forward. How can we help this student master this task beyond where we are taking them right now? Mm-hmm. 

Andrea McCarty: Mm-hmm. 

Mary Saghafi: You know, 

Shannon Betts: I mean, Andrea, I'm even doing structured word inquiry with that fifth grader with the UFLI.

Mm-hmm. I mean, 'cause they start with. I had to start with this fifth grader this summer with at, at lesson like five on UFLI. Yeah. Because she's that behind of a reader. Mm-hmm. But I needed to incorporate grammar and all of these advanced things that she was gonna be getting in the upper elementary grades.

And so I knew I could use stuctured word inquiry as a tool to do that because like they add, I think in like maybe a decodable 10 or 11, they have words with the s suffix. 

Andrea McCarty: Right. 

Shannon Betts: And both instances of the s suffix, [00:31:00] like if it's a plural or if it's the subject verb agreement, you know? Mm-hmm. Like the cats run or the cat, you know, or the cat runs.

Like they have both of those sentences in those decodables. And I could get into some pretty sophisticated conversations with my fifth grade student, even as a low reader about. How the S suffix behaved differently and things like that. And applying in her own writing. Mm-hmm. And I think what, why Mary and I have taken a structured inquiry too, and it sounds like this is your approach to teaching is to encourage that engagement in students and that curiosity, and it is an approach that does that because it's 

Andrea McCarty: right, 

Shannon Betts: you know, 

Andrea McCarty: well, one of the pre-questions that you'd sent to me was what's, what's a struggle right now?

And, and behavior management is a struggle. And I would say I have a pretty strong grasp of behavior management and I, I expect a lot from my students. I work them very hard, but keeping them engaged, I feel like I'm a little bit of a song and dance, and you've gotta [00:32:00] keep them engaged as much as possible because their attention is just so low and some of the behaviors are extreme.

So anything that we could do to make it. Exciting and engaging for them. On the word level side, like last week we were doing ng, that was our week, I think it was week 51. And I queued up, this is so funny. I queued up on my computer, the Gong sound, and I accidentally had, we have a light speed system, so it's an intercom all over the classroom, speaker all over the classroom.

And they were working really quietly actually on their decodable. And I did the gong sound. Well, the volume was turned up a little too loud and it kind of startled them and. I said, that's a gong. And we did our, you know, sound with it. And then they wanted it all day long, of course. And I said, yes, you can come up and push the gong.

And they wanted to see what it was, but anything to get them engaged. And sometimes those are unplanned, they're off the cuff. [00:33:00] And that's where that with itness comes in as a teacher of, okay, they love the gong sounds. So whatever I can do to keep the engagement level high because it's, it's no joke right now.

Some of those behaviors are pretty extreme and if, if that's what got them engaged on that day, then so be it. 

Shannon Betts: I love that. I did that lesson with that fifth grader actually last week, so I'm gonna uhhuh to play a gong for her. I'm curious too, we have an episode coming up, oh, we haven't, it's not aired yet, but it's gonna be about the literacy block and how it's set up.

And so I'm curious, like what is your, how long is your literacy period and like, what does it look like and all the different components? 

Andrea McCarty: Our day starts at eight o'clock and kids come in and I I get right to it. I usually have an entry task for them to do. And honestly, the, the biggest engagement that I've seen with kids is their own personal book box.

It's not something that I've given up yet. I'm still a real believer in letting kids choose their books and they are engaged reading those books. They, they [00:34:00] wanna talk with each other and I am all for that. Like, share your book and then before we start our day, stand up and share a book that you are reading.

And I share with them books that I've got and they, you know, looking they, my UFLI manual is usually the one and they recognize that. But, so we start out our day with that. We do a morning meeting circle, and I won't give that up either because. I've had some kids go through some really hard things and they will share with one another and it's beautiful.

So we start a day with that. I try to start my phonics routine before 8: 30 if possible. So it's quick, it's pretty fast in order to fit it all in, that was one of the struggles I said, is time, having enough time to fit it all in? So try to get that UFLI lesson done within that eight 30 to nine o'clock time.

But honestly, sometimes, especially on the word building part, because we have magnetic boards and letters for the kids to use, sometimes I am okay with if they are [00:35:00] really going on something and having fun and creating something on their own, I'll let 'em do it. And it extends our time a little bit. But that's okay.

Based on some pullout that I have to accommodate other kids, I. Transition real quickly into my writing time and it's a structured writing program that we use. And this is maybe a side note after, but I wanna talk to you about that. So you might edit that part out. But anyway, we do our writing and then I try to keep them at a writing like cliffhanger.

So we go to recess real quick, we come back and then they get right back into their writing for just a little bit before I move into my independent time, which I call a must do may do, which I know a lot of teachers use. So you must work through these things. And then on the other side of a slide up, you may do these literacy activities, all of which I'm happy if you do them.

And I, I track at the beginning of the year what kids [00:36:00] choose for their may do time. That's really telling for me of what they do. And I change it up a little bit so it could be epic where they're listening to books being read aloud. They could write in their journal if they want. They can go back to their book box, which is the most popular thing that they choose.

Boom Cards is another one. Sometimes I have that as a must do if it's a skill check that I wanna check that they've retained the skill from a few weeks prior. I have a partner reading, and then we have something called free read where I pull books from our, our classroom library based on what we're learning that they can choose from, that sometimes they're partner games from, from sounds to spelling the old ones that I'll pull out and they, they like those. Okay. But I tend to send those home with kids. So during that time I'm pulling my small group intervention and that's the one thing on U Fly that I've really appreciated hearing Holly Lane speak to. You don't have to meet with every kid every day.

That was, that was a practice that was really hard for me to let go of [00:37:00] from my guided reading days. It felt like that's what you're supposed to do. But I'm using the project read along with UFLI so I can scan their dictation. That is amazing. I, that has changed my planning and cut my planning time so much.

And the data you get from that is just so telling. So I like the way that gives me my small group and even the timestamp of seven to eight minutes. You should do this with this group. Three minutes. You should go back into this routine and do this. That's super helpful. So then we go to lunch and when we come back from lunch, if we need to finish up the must do may do stuff, we will.

And then I do my, my read aloud for the week, which that's still in kind of limbo for me of how much I'm loving doing that. Just because of our curriculum. We're not really doing as much of the district adopted one. A lot of us do another supplement that's got a fiction and nonfiction companion component.

And I [00:38:00] supplement a lot with that. More knowledge building based on whatever the book is and just trying to come up with my own lessons for that because the knowledge building part, I'm really kind of taking the cue from my students on what they wanna learn from that. It's a little bit unstructured.

I like the way I do it. I find it's a little hard for me to explain to somebody else without me sounding like, well, I'm just doing what I want because that's not it. I'm not doing what I want. I'm very student led in that regard. And then I move more to my math and science for the rest of the day. 

Mary Saghafi: That's so helpful.

It's nice to envision what your day looks like and especially when you're, you know, supplementing a lot too. It's nice to hear, you know, how that kind of flows through your lesson block. And I think that it's really freeing too, to say that you don't have to meet with every single student during your intervention piece because some kids really need that [00:39:00] more.

They need more practice turns, they just do. And I think that's the one piece that I was really missing when I did my master's degree. Because I was really hoping, just like you, I would get that magic bullet, like teach me to teach non-readers to become readers. And I think the piece that I didn't understand was that some kids really need a lot of consistent practice and you might have taught them and then they go to second grade and it is just not anchored to anything in their brain.

And so then therefore they can't apply it. And that part is so important, you know, to make sure that those foundational skills really stick and become automatic. And I was also thinking, as we were chatting before, before, to become automatic or skilled or fluent, mastered in a, in a piece, you have to be able to do the work yourself.

Mm-hmm. You have to know without a prompt, how do [00:40:00] I get started on this task? And I think, my position is a little unique since I'm doing one-on-one tutoring right now. So I'm not pretending that classroom management isn't an issue. But I would say that if the kids are doing the work, that's when they're getting, they're engaged.

That's when the highest part of engagement happens. And sometimes that's the call and response that you're doing. And sometimes it's the holding up the whiteboards and sometimes it's actually having them do, you know, a full dictation. Sometimes it is actually doing the journal writing and having a real authentic conversation with a peer about how they need to edit that.

So I think that, ugh. The challenge is, and some of the benefit to technology is one, it can be highly distracting and can be inappropriately used, and that part is hard, but also it can be used for additional practice turns and, and engagement. And I think that [00:41:00] our kids' brains are just moving really fast today because they've had that constant interaction for such a long time.

So I'm, I'm totally with all of the teachers and how hard it is for engagement right now, but I think that we still have to have that student centered piece where the students are really doing the work and it's not the teacher just lecturing all the time. It's so 

Andrea McCarty: Absolutely 

Mary Saghafi: that part. 

Andrea McCarty: We have to, I feel like after I finish my UFLI lessons, I've gotta watch and it'll say like, one day at the beginning it said, I completed my workout.

I was like, I just am teaching. It's hilarious. My heart was up and you're moving around and you're doing the clicker and the, all the, all the parts. But I think that's why I like first grade so much is they, they are still for the most part, very engaged and so excited when they're finally getting something that feels really rewarding.

Or we just came off of conference week a few weeks ago and a lot of parents [00:42:00] saying, I'm just really seeing my kid reading and wanting to read things and feeling successful, and that feels really good to be a part of that. 

Shannon Betts: I'm thinking about, you know, you just finished the NG and the NK lesson and like what comes next is.

The first lesson with magic E And so like, like I, I mean I'm really setting the stage for my student, you know, because she's been a non-reader for all these years. You know, getting up to fifth grade and really she should be in sixth grade. And so you're gonna get the same exact thing coming back from the Thanksgiving holiday of, okay, we're about to hit long vowels, so are you gonna do anything extra?

I'm gonna do that FCRR activity that Mary and I talk about all the time, you know, with the, the picture sort, with the long and short vowels. Yeah. You know, like the whale and the bat one. 

Mary Saghafi: Mm-hmm. 

Shannon Betts: I feel like the student needs that one just to like be aware that, you know, we don't throw away the short vowel sounds just 'cause we're adding long vowels.

Mary Saghafi: Yeah. 

Shannon Betts: Yeah. And then I think I'm going to, for this fifth grade student, because she has so much oral vocabulary. Because she's [00:43:00] older. I'm gonna immediately jump into the Homophone principle as well. And just really like the second we do MALE, we're gonna do MAIL for mail. Mm-hmm. And, and just sort of add those homophones as we come to them and start hopefully set the stage for learning those long vowel teams a lot faster when it comes down in the scope of sequence.

But yes. What else are you doing to get the kids ready, you know, in your mind? Like what are you gonna be doing for that long vowel? 

Andrea McCarty: Well, we do secret stories too, and I really do like those because the, they're so engaging for the kids and you're telling it like it's a big secret, and they're so excited and they're, they're in a different spot in our room.

So when it's time to do a secret story, I'm like, it's time. And then we move our whole bodies over there and we turn off the lights and I just try to set the anticipation for it so they already see it and they, when are we gonna learn that? And I'm like, it's coming. It's coming. Just keep, I just keep saying to them, keep coming to school.

We'll find out on this day. So they're excited about that. And [00:44:00] building the visuals that, that, that offers even on the sound wall. I had a sound wall for a long time. Thanks to Alison Ryan and that pushing there was a teacher that I followed on social media and during COVID, she was giving her sound wall for free and it had.

The mouth cards and the, the real life pictures. And so watching the kids be involved in those visuals has become very helpful. That was always a practice that I did is not put those up before. You use them so that you are building them with the kids, but the secret stories are up early. And some of those things from from sounds dispelling those word sorts, she, or picture sorts too.

She did such a good job having those for kids. So I'm supplementing some of the UFLI stuff with that. You know, we're told do it with fidelity, but that's always been like an F word, like. Fidelity to what, because I really wanna be with what my kids need. So if I know they need a little bit extra and I know [00:45:00] that this is good, I'm gonna bring it in because it's going to help them.

And I'm, I'm just okay with if the lesson takes a little bit longer and then I've gotta cut something else shorter because they're really engaged, I'll do it. That, that to me is worth it. Do a lot of songs. You know, the Reader's Garden. Have you looked at any of those songs that she's done from the Reader's Garden?

I have. 

Mary Saghafi: Mm-hmm. I used to do those like a way a long time ago. That's so cute. 

Andrea McCarty: It's so good. And the kids love these songs. They get stuck in your head, of course. But is it Andrea Gardner, I think is her name for the Reader's Garden. She has just done an amazing job of making songs that are right with what, what the kids are learning.

Like right now, my kids, can we listen to the irregular word song? Like when did I ever think that first graders would be saying irregular word and know what it means and be excited about it? And she's got one about die graphs and they listen. They're singing, they know what those [00:46:00] high words are, those big brain words we call them.

So songs are a really big part. I put those still in. I use an I could read Notebook, which is back from the days of Nelly Edge when she did a lot of, nursery rhymes, songs and poems that you would do together. That's a practice that I've refined it and changed it, but I still have that as a component in my literacy time.

So I have a binder, the kids take it home on Friday. There's usually two or three songs or poems that match whatever we're learning. It could be a, a science concept, even a math concept. But a lot of those phonics songs, I'll type up the words and put them in there with a QR code so they can listen to them at home.

And kids love that. 

Shannon Betts: Y'all are giving me so many good ideas. That second grader, the English language learner I was talking about, he's really struggling too with all of the short vowels, you know, 'cause, you know, the Spanish speakers, they, they really struggle with that short E and the short I mm-hmm.

And I have not done. Because I'm like a travel teacher. I have not done the vowel [00:47:00] valley, but I think I need to with those real life pictures. I think that that would help him feel it in his mouth. That's one thing I've learned from structure word inquiry too, is that instead of they, they don't say sound it out anymore.

It's like, feel it and spell, feel it, spell it. 

Andrea McCarty: Mm-hmm. 

Shannon Betts: Because sounds are like barking and you know, a tea kettle whistle and not really phonic sounds like we use that word. So love that idea. Love secret stories. I wrote that down as well. So thank you for those strategies. 

Mary Saghafi: Yeah. I have a question for you next, and this was one of our questions, but what is it that you really wish that other teachers would have?

And I know that the, the answer that you gave really had to do with strong administration. Is that how you feel? 

Andrea McCarty: Yeah, it really is. I feel like when you're, when you're able to do from the ground up with the support of an administrator, like, I don't know how many book studies our principal let us do.

And [00:48:00] I, I will say, let us, because we would come with, there's this book, can we do this as a book group with our staff? She, yes, I'll help on the administrative end of getting the details worked out and let's do four or six weeks. So we did shifting the balance letter lessons I can't even think of all of them.

But having that inquiry based learning from a teacher perspective and then your principal following up on it instead of always being told, do this, do this. And you're like, that's not good. That's just more of the same. I remember feeling that when we were doing letters training. That is a heavy load to do while you are teaching.

I mean, that's the stuff I should have gotten, to be honest in my master's degree. But I didn't, and I, my, my, my district and my school board adopted that and paid for it. And that is, that's amazing that we were able to do that. So then continuing to do things at a district level and I'm like, [00:49:00] that's just more of the same.

I don't want more of the same. I kind of wanna go deeper. So let's revisit our letters. Let's, and our staff development, let's keep revisiting so you don't lose it. You don't have to keep grabbing. Although I have a lot of books, but I like the idea of a principal saying, what are you finding that you need to fill the gaps or have holes in and what is going to work for your team?

And I like the way that. Our principal would say, do this as a, as a team or a grade level, and then work together that'll drive your PLC conversations. I, I feel like that was really helpful to do that instead of feeling like at a district level, things were coming down at you and I, I don't wanna say always district against building because there are some really great things at a district level in my district, but also the reality is I have to go back into a classroom.

And I've gotta teach these things. So what's going to be helpful right now for me, not just always [00:50:00] theory, but the on the ground, I think during those assessment times, because assessment is so important, I remember going through a coaching pathway and the person kind of teaching us, saying we we're kind of in this assessment mode that everything has to be assessed and we can't just do assessment to do assessment.

So why are you doing assessment? And our district has done a good job of pairing that down. But in the younger grades, and even in the intermediate grades, a lot of that is one-on-one assessment. And you need time to be able to do that. And then it becomes this vicious cycle. If I'm gonna get time and you're going to get a sub for me, now I have to plan for the sub.

Now I know my behaviors are going to uptick. I've just lost 20 minutes of that time to be able to address these things just so I can one-on-one assess this kid to get information. So. Our principal would do a great job of, I'm gonna come in your classroom, I'm gonna bring this lesson with me. We are gonna do it.

Don't worry. Go in this space. Assess as many kids as you can [00:51:00] go. So having those things already done were super helpful. And then I had to let go of, but that's not my part of my lesson for the day. Like, who cares? I just wanna get my assessments done. Those like boots on the ground and coming in and checking to see what else do you need to get your assessments done?

What do you need to be able to try some of those things? Or I'll come cover your class for 15 minutes so you can go in this person's room. Just those real applicable things that also I think keeps your administrator grounded in the daily trenches and the work. Like, you know, I remember going to meetings and some of us, I'll, I'll be honest, grumbling and saying, but when was the last time you were in a classroom?

That you keep saying when I was in the classroom, but that was two decades ago. I'm in the classroom right now and I'm gonna go back and do it. So even having visibility come in the classroom and run this small group or do this word work [00:52:00] with the kids, I think that keeps our administrators really grounded in the work that we're doing is hard.

So then maybe that wouldn't be the case of things coming down. So top heavy, do this, do this, do this instead. Come and see what we're doing and do it with us. And it feels like a team. 

Mary Saghafi: The piece that I was thinking about too, and that I think this is so important is that the principal then has relationships with the students.

Mm-hmm. And that shows. So much when you can come to the principal and say, so-and-so is really struggling with this, or this happened at home, you know, I, I'm really concerned. I feel like some resources need to be kind of like shared this family's way and they know that student, they have a personal relationship.

They can also be part of the village that is taking care of this child rather than behind the scenes making the phone calls. Yes, but really following up, I think one of my favorite things about our school right now that my kids are in is that [00:53:00] the principal knows every single kid's name. She will send me a text message with my kid's picture because she had a great day and it was just, it just makes, it's incredible.

I know she doesn't have time to do that, but it is. Absolutely special that she thought of me and how proud I would be of my daughter to do that. You know, I'm not saying that everybody has to do that, but it goes a really long way for teachers and parents and students. Right? 

Andrea McCarty: Yeah. And I know that's a hard job.

Like we only have one administrator. We don't have an assistant. We have over 400 students. That is really hard. Our job is hard too, and there are always things that we could try to do, but I think being in each other's classrooms because it is a lonely space. I'm the only adult in there. I tell the kids how many all the time.

How many of you are there? 22. How many of me, one, like I'm never gonna win. There's more of you. We have to work together and we don't get that. [00:54:00] Collaboration all the time, or just, I feel like sometimes I'm on the office, like I just wanna look at a camera and be like, did anybody else see what just happened here?

Oh my gosh. Just told the kid to stop trying to lick their belly button. Like, it's hard. So having that opportunity to be in each other's space and seeing another teacher or an adult is so validating, like, okay, it's not perfect either in this classroom, but I like the way they're doing that. And likewise, I'm gonna invite people into my space.

It's not perfect. I'm, I'm at the same space as you. Like we did that with you. Fly. One of our kindergarten teachers said, can I just come in and watch? I loved what she did. I said, yes, come sit right here. And she was like, no, I wanna sit here and face the kids. I'm not here to watch you. I was like, right.

You wanna see how the kids are contributing? But having that, vulnerability to be able to do that. And it, it can be intimidating to ask your administrator to come in, they [00:55:00] evaluate you. That is hard. I understand that. But if we could get them to come in more than just those times, so like you said, they're familiar with kids and our practices and each other like, come in and what could I do a little different?

Just those small shifts make a really big difference in our practice. 

Shannon Betts: I agree with you that like my best principal I ever had, had that humility and that vulnerability. She used to do breakfast duty with us. 

Andrea McCarty: Mm. 

Shannon Betts: When I was reading specialist, and I mean, breakfast duty on pancake and syrup day is disgusting.

I mean, 

Andrea McCarty: that's no joke. 

Shannon Betts: Like the smell is just still in my nostrils. Yeah. And she was in there with the nasty rag, wiping it all up with us and she would, she would you know, take over classes if we needed to and things like that as well. I wanna emphasize this too, because you worked in the same school, you might, I dunno if you take it for granted or you're just used to it, but like you actually have all these colleagues that want to be in this professional learning community with you and read these books.

That has not always been the case for me. Like I was the phonics [00:56:00] nerd that wanted to read the books and everybody else was like. I don't wanna do any extra reading, you know? Right. For like, be quiet, Ms. 

Andrea McCarty: Miss 

Shannon Betts: Betts. 

Andrea McCarty: For me, it's, yes, 

Shannon Betts: be 

Andrea McCarty: quiet. It's, we know what you're gonna say. Podcast. We know. Here comes Andrea with Academy.

Listen to this podcast. I'm like, but it's so good. I just wanna talk to somebody. 

Shannon Betts: Well, I love that you have those colleagues that are all passionate about it with you, so I think that maybe that's why y'all keep staying together, working together. Yes. Because you all are a professional learning community in the truest sense of what that word means, as opposed to just sort of a trend that every district is trying to make happen in their schools.

Andrea McCarty: Yes. It is a great place to work and we're, we're like a family, so we're a little quirky and we've got, at times we wanna roll our eyes at each other. But I know it's a safe place to say, this isn't working with this kid. I know you know this kid. Help me. What else can I try? And to be able, like, like our K one wing, to be able to say, go over to your kindergarten teacher and tell her thank you for teaching you that, or to celebrate that is.

That's what makes the job so [00:57:00] great that you can have those celebrations with each other, because it's not just me. They put in a lot of front loading in kindergarten and then to catch up with them in second grade and to have their second grade teacher say, oh my gosh, look what they're doing. Like, I gotta be a piece of that.

That is so unique about our job. 

Shannon Betts: Are y'all doing UFLI, like K to two? And how do you do that with the scope and sequence? With like, jumping from lesson to lesson? At the start of the school year, 

Andrea McCarty: we, we actually did all the getting ready lessons. 

Shannon Betts: Okay. 

Andrea McCarty: At the beginning. And then I, I will say our Kinder garden teachers, they're, they're trying to find their way.

It feels really fast for them and they're really trying. My dog wants to say hi. There he is. But, so we went in the back of the book where it has the scope and sequence for this is where kindergarten should start. This is where first grade should start, here's where second grade should start. So we just picked right up where it said to start and said, let's just see what happens.

And still right away people were like, but from sounds to spelling, we [00:58:00] know it works so well. Like it does, we can still use components of that, but let's, let's get going on this. But that kindergarten one, they're still trying to find that sweet spot and I don't really know how to support them with that yet, but just encourage them.

Just feels fast to them right now. It's fast. 

Shannon Betts: I think what I'm gonna do, like reading Universe I don't know if you've checked out that website in a while. No, 

Andrea McCarty: I'm gonna write that down. 

Shannon Betts: You know, we had them come, we had the person that created that site she was from Mississippi and like worked on the Mississippi, like Miracle Marathon mm-hmm.

Whatever, to get their scores. So Well, and we had her on a couple seasons ago, and since then she's working now on this Reading Universe site and it's, it's becoming more robust than even like FCRR in terms of like, they have decodables for like every sound. They have word cars and everything, and they're adding stuff to it all the time.

And so I think for that one second grader that's going so slowly through the Uline, since I'm gonna be pulling from Reading Universe and like [00:59:00] basically doing, you know, if we, if we, we worked on the, the GA lesson mm-hmm. Then we're gonna do, I'm gonna do g from, you know, the reading universe resources as well, just to like extend it out.

And I might, I'll have to check in with our kindergarten teacher and, and see how she's pacing as well. 'Cause in the school that I go in and push into, they are using it K one and two based on the kindergarten teachers urging. She started at, at the same time I did right when it came out. And she fell in love with you, fly and like convinced her colleagues to use it.

Andrea McCarty: Yeah, those videos online, the training videos, I, I probably watched each of those probably a dozen times. Or as you start doing it, you are like, okay, I need to refine this a little bit more. I'm gonna go back and watch this section. That's super helpful. But it, it's always something. So they,

Shannon Betts: I haven't even seen those.

They're the videos for the routines. 

Andrea McCarty: Yeah. 

Shannon Betts: Oh, 

Andrea McCarty: there, there's five of them. And so it's, and Holly Lane's on them, which is super to me. I'm like, there's the [01:00:00] validity. You helped create this and you're still there answering questions. So they walk through getting ready and then day one, day two assessment, and then I forget what the may, maybe the fifth one might be intervention and differentiation perhaps.

But they're on YouTube. So look on YouTube, UFLI lessons and they're really good. They're about an hour. 

Mary Saghafi: It is so interesting that you went to UFLI and the lessons, because I was thinking about Reading Universe and Reading Universe has some really fantastic lessons as well, and I happen to know that if you want to see what a good kindergarten routine looks like, they definitely have those modeled.

And I think that it's not so much just the classroom management piece, but it's the pacing that you wanna see. What is it that the kids can handle? Mm-hmm. How does that back and forth look? And so I, that's what I am, 

Shannon Betts: the teacher feedback is really good too in those videos from reading universe of like, okay, the student made an error.

This is how the teacher, you know, 

Andrea McCarty: interesting. Yeah. I'll [01:01:00] have to check that out. 

Shannon Betts: Ites that in real time. 

Andrea McCarty: Okay. 

Mary Saghafi: Yeah. I really love the Reading Universe website too. Any question that I have, I'm like, oh, I'm just not solid on this topic yet. Or I suspect that a kid is having trouble, you know, making the correct mouth sound or what, whatever it is they have.

Every topic and they are constantly adding to it. So that is a really, that's cool. Phenomenal free resource too. Yeah. 

Andrea McCarty: Being free. That's so, that's so generous. I feel like when people are able to do that, or for a minimal cost too, there's just more, you might, 

Shannon Betts: you wanna share it too, apparently, like they're working on like a certification course or like mini course for paras.

Andrea McCarty: Oh wow. 

Shannon Betts: With training through the reading universe. And based on the conversation you and I are having before we hit record, that might be really helpful as a resource to share where you work. 

Andrea McCarty: Great. Thank you so much. 

Shannon Betts: Well, we could talk to you like we could continue talking to you but we wanna be mindful of your time.

So is there anything else you wanna share while we're chatting with you? [01:02:00] 

Andrea McCarty: I would say people that are in the classroom for an extended amount of time. It's funny because I think in most careers it's like, well, what are you are gonna be a principal? Like, well that's not. Being a principal is great for some people, but I really love the classroom.

I love just on the ground with the kids and their families too. I think as my career has evolved and I have some longevity, I'm, I'm older now than a lot of the parents, and so to be able to talk to them like, you're doing a good job. You're reading with them every night, you are playing games with them.

You're just involvement. But that, that longevity is really important, not only for the people you work with, but for yourself to feel like it's okay that you keep changing and evolving and trying to find. I think I, in fact, I had somebody say to me, why does it take you [01:03:00] so long to get ready at the beginning of the year?

Aren't, don't you just do the same thing you've already always done? It was a family member, like, oh my gosh, if I was still doing the same thing. That I was doing when I first started, that would not be good. But also that's the, maybe the most creative part of learning in the classroom is I think about those kids that I didn't serve very well and I can name them.

And it, I know for a lot of people that like gets them emotional and I'm like, one, 

Shannon Betts: the ones who got away. 

Andrea McCarty: But it's true. You think of them and I think of them like Kia who said to me the word will doesn't make sense. That shouldn't be there. And it was of, and I was like, you are right. You are right. And I, I am being stubborn and I'm not changing it for what's best for all kids is this is what's best for a lot of kids.

But I just, I would say like I, I linked that article, find your Marigold. It sounds so cheesy, but find the people that you can have conversation with. And that's maybe the best [01:04:00] thing about social media is, I mean, look, we are across the country from each other, and I know this won't be the only time that we talk because having those like-minded people that now I'm gonna go back and I'm gonna look up all those things that we shared and I'm gonna be excited to share things with you.

And that is the best part about this job is we can be creative, we can share we, we can be vulnerable. And then I'm gonna be in front of 22 little faces next week. And all of these things that we talked about are going to influence how I teach them in such a great way. It's not a stagnant job. And yes, there are hard parts about it and there are parts that.

Are bigger than we are that we can't control, but what we can control are the kids right in front of us and we can show up and be the best for them, whether it's in your small group or your whole group, or those conversations that you want to help your colleagues because they're coming to have a conversation.

Those are the things that get exciting, like when we're [01:05:00] done here, to be able to share with my really good friends and say, oh my gosh, we just had this great conversation. Now have you heard about Reading Universe? You know, those are the the fun things about those, the jobs. So just keep it on the things that energize you, not the things that bog you down.

Shannon Betts: Amen.

Mary Saghafi: And I agree with you. That is well stated. Exactly. Yeah. I, it's so nice. Sometimes Shannon and I will say like, oh, don't we just wish that you were right across the hall from us. And I can absolutely say that. Like, I really wish I could teach across the hall from you. It's so nice to share that. And you're right, a blessing of social media and having a platform like our podcast to share is, is really helpful.

But I really appreciate your on the ground perspective. I appreciate that you can say this is what makes our, my, my school unique. This makes our district unique. I'm not, I can only speak to what's happening in my building, and I think those are the conversations that are [01:06:00] so important for other teachers to hear.

So I'm, I'm eager to share that and I, I'm so glad this is not gonna be our only conversation too, because I think that you, the way that you share things and you're so passionate, I, I can imagine what it would be like to be a first grader in your classroom, and I can tell that, you know, you share with such love and, and excitement and it, it's, it's very evident that you are such a glowing teacher that I think that's how I would describe you.

Andrea McCarty: That's very kind. Thank you. 

Mary Saghafi: Of course. 

Shannon Betts: This has been such a pleasure and you're a great fit in the Reading Teachers Lounge, so we appreciate you sharing your time and expertise with us. 

Andrea McCarty: Thank you so much. I look forward to more conversations. 

Mary Saghafi: Us too. 

Andrea McCarty: All right.