August 2025 bonus episode

In this August bonus episode of Reading Teacher Lounge, Mary and Shannon exchange insights on recent articles they've read. They dive into practical strategies for supporting students, especially those with ADHD. They discuss homework routines, communication between teachers and parents, and how to create structured homework environments. Mary shares guidelines from ADDitude and Edutopia on effective homework systems and collaboration between special education and general education teams. Shannon highlights a thought-provoking article from The Atlantic about Lucy Calkins' impact on the reading crisis, emphasizing the need for nuanced approaches and critical thinking in education. The episode concludes with helpful resources for teachers and parents.

00:00 Welcome to Reading Teacher Lounge

00:32 Diving into Advocacy and Action Items

01:34 ADHD Homework Strategies

05:46 Setting Up Homework Routines

13:34 Facilitating Collaboration in Special Education

19:23 Connecting with the Team Throughout the Year

19:55 Implementing the UFLI Curriculum

20:20 Functional Assessments and Monthly Check-ins

20:59 Advocacy Meetings and Solution-Oriented Approaches

21:27 Gamifying Literacy with Edutopia

23:34 The Atlantic Article on Lucy Calkins

32:10 Letters from Teachers on Reading Instruction

37:35 Subscription Hacks for Accessing Articles

39:31 Final Thoughts and Season Eight Preview

RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE:

1. Rief, Sandra, M.A., and ADDitude Editors. “The ADHD Homework System We Swear By.” ADDitude Magazine (updated online June 19, 2025).
2. FREE ADHD Resource: Solve Your Child's Homework Problems
3. Ellison, Samantha. “4 Strategies to Facilitate Collaboration Across Special Education Teams.” Edutopia, 7 Aug. 2025
4. “3 Games to Amp Up Reading Instruction.” Edutopia, George Lucas Educational Foundation, 25 July 2025
5. Lewis, Helen. “How One Woman Became the Scapegoat for America’s Reading Crisis.” The Atlantic, December 2024 issue (published online November 13, 2024).
6. “ ‘There Is No One-Size-Fits-All Approach to Reading Instruction’ — Readers respond to our December 2024 issue and more.” The Atlantic, March 2025 issue (published online February 18, 2025).
7. Reading Team episode 7.6
8. Engagement episode 7.12

• Get Literacy Support through our Patreon

Transcript

Shannon Betts: 0:06

Hey, welcome to Reading Teacher Lounge. This is our August bonus episode. Mary, I'm just, we've been reading a lot of. We've been sharing like articles back and forth a lot. Yep. And so I just wanna hear what you're reading right now and let's share that with everybody else.

Mary Saghafi: 0:20

Yeah. I think this is gonna be a fun little bonus episode to just sort of like, get a peek into the headlines that we're reading and what we're diving into right now, so. Mm-hmm. I'm excited to share a few of these things. Some of the articles that I've been reading are not like research based articles. What I've been kind of diving into is like, what are some action items that I should really be aware of for advocacy at the beginning of the year? How can I help my clients kind of get prepared? So the first one that I wanna talk about is. One of my favorite magazines actually is the a DD attitude. It's A-D-D-I-T-U-D-E. And it used to be called a DD Mag magazine. And so this one is. So let me just share that they share lots of neurodiversity and inclusion ways that teachers can and parents can use to support their students. So mainly the focus is for people with A DHD adults through children. But this one, this article is specifically about homework and studying and oh my goodness,

Shannon Betts: 1:20

I wish I had read it two nights ago when I was helping my own A DHD student with his middle school homework.

Mary Saghafi: 1:28

It's never too early to. Start. Okay. It's never too late to begin. Okay, so you're, you're, you're in good chance. So let me just tell you, this is the A DHD homework system we swear by, that's the name of the title. Okay. Okay. So. Basically we know that homework can be challenging for all students, but particularly students with executive functioning issues. It can really, really be challenging. So you wanna set them up with a lot of structure for success. So basically this is by one of the editors at the magazine. And so her name is Sandra Reef. And so here's what she says. A DD and executive functioning, functioning deficits. It's equal to stress. That's what stress is caused by in kids, especially when it it comes to their homework stress. So one of the first things that you wanna do is make sure that your kids have the things that they need, right? And so you need to have kind of a station that includes all of these. Let's kind of take it step by step about like what are the most important parts. So the first part that they say is get the teachers on board. And this is what really caught my eye because when I was. Not a parent and a teacher. I did not understand homework in the way that it really should have been. What it's

Shannon Betts: 2:45

like at home versus what it's like at the school. Exactly. Building.

Mary Saghafi: 2:49

Yeah. And really the purpose of homework. I fully admit I assigned way too much homework for my students, and a lot of it was because I wanted them to apply what they were learning outside of the classroom. So intentions were good. Mm-hmm. But then the execution of it can just be grueling for some parents. So you really wanna get the teachers on board and let the teachers know that. Giving assignments in advance can be really helpful or allowing the family to kind of structure homework throughout the week and allow the children some choice as to, you know, let's start the week with a harder assignment, so if we need to revisit it, we can go back to it. So giving some options for how it. Delivered back to the teacher. And if there's more time always valuable,

Shannon Betts: 3:37

that's helpful too. Like, kind of because of soccer practices and other, you know, afterschool activities.

Mary Saghafi: 3:43

Exactly. So you know that, you know, soccer's on a Wednesday night, so you're gonna front load homework on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday may be no homework, but Thursday's another catch up day. Mm-hmm. You know, kind of things like that. Or maybe piano lessons are also on Thursday, so you wanna make sure that is kind of a light homework night. And not that the teacher has to be responsible for it, that is where the student and the parents and their home you know. Learning can kind of make those decisions. Right? The

Shannon Betts: 4:13

teacher would just be the only responsibility with the teacher's end would be assigning the homework and then making sure it's like a flexible deadline kind of system.

Mary Saghafi: 4:21

Exactly. Yep. So what else? I, so step two is. Don't let your kids leave school without, right. So you wanna make sure that they have a daily routine that they're utilizing at school to make sure that whatever needs to come home comes home. So what they suggest is maybe having a. Study buddy that could help give reminders. So let's say your student doesn't need, you know, a very formal system, but maybe they have a buddy that they can either reach out to from home. You know, as a parent you have the text for other families. But then the other part is like, let's just make sure that our students have a checklist. What is it that they need? So if they are a student who needs more support, and this should not be for all students in the classroom, this should just be for the students whose. Particularly need it. Mm-hmm. You know, maybe they have a written form that goes home. Maybe this is part of their daily planner that they're utilizing and then the parent signs off on it. Maybe the teacher posts on a website maybe, and, and. Automatically the teacher should be posting at home, but excuse me, on the board, and then that should be copied. But just depending on those student's needs, how can you be flexible as the teacher providing that? And how can you ensure that that homeschool communication is happening? And so. Then at home you wanna set up a specific routine. So including your child in this discussion, you wanna know when is homework time and how can that become the habit? It should be at a specific scheduled time. It should be predictable throughout the week and keep it as consistent as possible. So beginning homework within about an hour after your school. Full arrival is, is best for students. And then I. So basically either, you know, home after school or after the school activities that can kind of help your child really, you know, make sure that they are following that routine. Make sure so if your schedule kind of permits that. For us, we do a snack. We give a little downtime. 30 minutes later it's part of their chores to start their homework. And then we actually use a digital skylight at our house, which is kind of like a digital calendar, and it has checklists for the tasks that my kids are required to do at home, and they're able to check off when they have completed their homework. My older daughter really needs to also return her. Homework to her backpack. Otherwise it doesn't always get back to school. So that is also a secondary checklist that she has to do on her chore list is that you have to, and also homework is back in your backpack. So that's kind of how we work on that. Location of where homework is done should be really specific. Maybe it's a place that has good lighting. I would say that it needs to be free of a lot of visual distractions, so TV should not be on sometimes quiet music in the background is really helpful for some kids, so I think that can be determined. I would suggest that you don't want an Alexa or an AI kind of thing where they're asking the questions or trying to get the answer. Course it should be somewhat supervised, but independently completed if possible. Let's see, so next, remember that as a parent, and I would say if you are a teacher, encourage your parents to understand this concept. A parent is the coach. Homework should be assigned so that students are applying what they've learned. Parents don't need to be doing the homework for the students. You shouldn't be walking your students step by step by step by step. If you are, you have to decide what is the reason behind that. Is it because they don't understand the material? Or is it behavioral reason where they're just kind of fighting you on what's happening? And then communicate that with the teacher and, and let them know. Home and school communication can be really important. The teacher can say to the student, Hey. I hear you're giving your parents kind of a hard time at school. Are you confused about it or is it just that you don't wanna do it because. We're on the same team and there are not secrets between parents and teachers. We want you to be successful and part of this is you stepping up and doing this. Those conversations from an outside adult tend to go a really long way with students. And having some positive reinforcement teaching the parents to give positive feedback like wow. It's been five minutes, you've been focusing for five minutes. What a really good job you're doing. Or, I really like that you worked out that problem, even though it was kind of hard for you. Giving that specific praise is helpful. So the other piece in that is maybe just getting them started and slowly walking away. I love using a timer. We use timers all the time at my house. I use timers all the time. So maybe you set the timer for the first 10 minutes and they hit their stride and you say, Hey, can you keep going? I think you've done it for 10 minutes. That's really great. Or I see that you're struggling. I'm gonna have you focus for 10 more minutes. Then you can take a break, but then you have to come back and finish. Maybe we'll set a timer for the second part too. That usually takes away the control from the parent and puts it on the time of the timer. Mm-hmm. Also, kids with a DHD have time blindness a lot of times, and so they don't know how long it's going to take. It feels like it's either going to take forever. Or it's going to be done very fast and you need to allow them a lot of practice to feel what the time feels like. Sometimes that includes taking a break and refocusing and so you might wanna have them do some movement, some jumping jacks, some things like that. We're getting close, but as I had kind of stated before, praise and effort. And then making sure again, you have a place to put your completed homework for our family. It is back in your backpack. It's not that. So

Shannon Betts: 10:34

there's not that next morning. Yes. Rush. Yeah. So

Mary Saghafi: 10:37

the next morning scramble. Exactly. And we don't wanna have that misplaced homework. If you find that your student or your child is really struggling with more of this, encourage more investigation to find out what's going on. You, there might be some other underlying causes that maybe a doctor needs to get more involved in, or if medication is working or not working or you know, other underlying issues. And then the final step is actually there's two. I, I don't wanna leave this one out and let's have a plan for long-term assignments. Make sure that you can help that student chunk big, long-term projects, days, or even sections of what needs to be accomplished. And then finally, make it as fun as possible. Humor goes a really long way. You know, see if you can make light of situations, ask how you can you know, make things different. So. If you're reading a book together, let's say strike a quick conversation about, Hey, this character's really interesting, what do you think? Or do you think this is gonna happen or this is gonna happen next? Mm-hmm. Engaging them in that can be really fun. Anyway, so I thought this was great. And then also bonus that comes with it, there's a free download for the top five homework frustrations and how to fix each of those frustrations. So I'll put a link to that. Very cool. Yeah. Yeah. So I really like that one being specific.

Shannon Betts: 12:06

We need to have a total overhaul of our system, I think, because we've been doing homework differently kind of every night. So, and I think that's, so the lack of consistency is stressing both of us out. So I. And this is a transition from like, you know, homework's different from elementary to to middle school. Yeah. So we, we didn't quite know how to make a system'cause we didn't know what we were dealing with. So,

Mary Saghafi: 12:28

agreed, this is

Shannon Betts: 12:29

this hearing all this is coming at a good time.'cause we can acknowledge that it did not go well this week. And so we're gonna need to make some changes.

Mary Saghafi: 12:37

Yeah. And I think that partnership is really critical so that they know that it really is their responsibility. Mm-hmm. But that the family is going to be supportive. And I think too for teachers, don't ignore this homework issue. This is a perfect way to start partnering with parents right at the beginning of the year and helping them kind of know you know, what are some great strategies that work? Have you had issues with homework in the past? Mm-hmm. How can we be as supportive as possible to really build up those good habits at the beginning of this year? And that's a good topic that could be brought up during the first parent-teacher conferences. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Yep. Yep. So I love that one. And there's another one that I love, but I feel like I've been chatting for a little bit. No,

Shannon Betts: 13:20

no, no. I'm excited to hear all this. So, okay, so, but I can share the article. I've been read too, if you want, if you want take break. I

Mary Saghafi: 13:26

think I can do this. So these are just four strategies. So I also like this for the beginning of the year. So this one comes. Yeah, it comes from Edutopia. Okay. And the title is Four Strategies to Facilitate Collaboration Across Special Education Teams.

Shannon Betts: 13:40

Okay. Oh, kind of like the reading team we talked about

Mary Saghafi: 13:43

exactly like the reading team episode that we had did before. So we can link back to that. But this is where you create. Effective systems for special education teachers and general education teachers and really set your students up for success for that collaboration piece. Because part of it is really just communication, right? It's, it's, yeah. No,

Shannon Betts: 14:03

and I, I just, this week started going back to, I, I'm actually just going back to the. Private school that I used to work at, but now I'm going there as a, as a tutor. So instead of being like a, a resource teacher on staff, I'm the tutor. So first off, that is ensuring that I am pull out. Mm-hmm. But that's also making that collaboration and communication even more important because the teachers aren't seeing what I'm doing and I'm not seeing what they're doing. Right.'cause it's all happening outside the classroom. So, yeah. I'd love to hear some tips about Yeah. You know, just how to make that communication a little easier and less time consuming.

Mary Saghafi: 14:37

Well, and I think too as a special education teacher, I always felt this was like my responsibility to take the lead on it. But I don't think that that necessarily has to be the case. Mm-hmm. I think that you would need to be flexible and general education teachers can also really take a lead in this because all teachers are responsible for the students within their classroom. So. The first part I did not do this, but I really love this idea. And that's mapping the student's special education team. And I feel like we have lots of tools right now that would make this really easy. But specifically, here's the student and then here are all of the teachers that are impacting that student's learning right now. And some may have more time with others. Mm. So for example, if they have you know, a co-taught class and you know that this is the special education teacher of record, and then they have a math. Class, and they might have a separate special education teacher. Maybe it's a pullout situation. Maybe it is a push in collaborative learning situation. Maybe paraprofessionals are involved in that. Making sure that you know specifically who is in charge, and then don't forget to include the specialist teachers. Mm-hmm. This. It's in incredibly important that all the special education teachers are also aware of any accommodations that students should have, especially at the beginning of the year. So you might not have as much of a say, but for example, if you're the general education teacher and you're taking a class into the PE room, you know that a kiddo has already had a lot of sensory issues leading up to this you know, maybe a meltdown 10 minutes before, let's say. Gosh forbid that that has already happened in the classroom, but we know that it can. Giving that teacher a heads up and some strategies about what have has already helped to calm that student down goes such a long way So. Just really having a clear view of, okay, this student is working with this teacher, and because we're responsible for so many students and so many different kids have different schedules, this can really help the whole team know who is working with whom. So I love that. And then it, with that, you can begin to build those effective pathways for communication. And then the second piece, and this is often created with school systems in mind, but the school systems systems happen to usually be more broad. So you should develop a centralized, secure. Digital support hub. So maybe a shared part of your Google Drive might be helpful with you know, maybe it's secured with a password or something to protect the student's you know, information. But, this makes it really specific for caseload caseworkers to, you know, kind of keep an eye on what's the data that's already been taken. It's an easy way for anybody to be able to see what that student is working on. For high school or middle school students, they might wanna see and track their own progress too, so they may have access as well as their parents have access. This is a complicated issue, and each school and family probably has very specific rules, but I really like this idea of having a centralized digital hub For all of this information, specifically the accommodations, or if parents have written any letters about an introduction to this. Student would be a great place to have that. And shared

Shannon Betts: 18:04

observation notes would be very helpful for like upcoming meetings

Mary Saghafi: 18:08

or even like a short video. Sometimes videos are not allowed, but sometimes parents could record a video and that could also live there too. Just as a way or a showing like. This is what the you know, work, this is what the student should look like. Doing this and providing students with that example of, look at you, your feet are on the ground, you are holding the pencil correctly, you're doing your work quietly. Mm-hmm. And being able to share that video can also be really powerful for students too. So next. This is really critical too. Plan strategically for what goes in the folder and what stays out of the folder. So you don't want to jam pack all of the information if it's not relevant. You don't need to have a stacked folder of all of the things. But if you happen to take a few notes on the top of a paper because you're noticing some observations that likely needs to stay in. You're So the one's most related

Shannon Betts: 19:09

to the instructional goals Yep. Would be the ones to teach? Yep.

Mary Saghafi: 19:11

If you're noting how much you're modeling for that student, or how much as assistance they need, how much in independent work they were able to accomplish on those. Those are things that wanna stay, but not every single paper. Okay. And then the fourth piece is connect with the team throughout the year. Make sure that you do those, check check-ins and, and make sure if it's not on somebody's radar, then it's likely just not on their radar. So if you do have those planned check-ins, either during a common planning time, which I am fully aware does not actually exist in most cases, make sure that you're planning for each of the students on the caseload or that are impacted in your class. So having those I like that.

Shannon Betts: 19:53

I know I could do that for sure. Like, the two students that I'm thinking about, I'm doing the Uly curriculum with them. Mm-hmm. That's, I mean, I'm using other tools as well, but that's kind of the main scope and sequence I'm following for the phonics at least. And so I could give a weekly summary or maybe biweekly or something and just say, Hey, we are, we've reached this lesson with, you know, this goal in mind. You know? Yep.

Mary Saghafi: 20:18

I think that goes a really long way. And then

Shannon Betts: 20:20

you Fly also has these like little, functional assessments kind of built in. So like that would be a quick check. You know, I could be like, okay, they, you know, they got ac, this much accuracy, this percentage of accuracy up to now.

Mary Saghafi: 20:33

I, I think that that would be really helpful. And even if it's a monthly check-in, I think that that would be, you know, totally reasonable on your part because it's not always reasonable to have that expectation. But I usually do a monthly check-in with the parents that I'm working with. And then I always have the parents initiate any collaborative emails with the teacher so that, you know, as a tutor, I'm l looped in that way. But also when I go into advocacy meetings, I like to be really solution oriented. Mm-hmm. So if there is not a system in place, how can I help suggest how a system could be put into place? And I really like the specifics of this one, and I like that it's vague enough that people could implement it you know, in their own. Way that would work best. Yeah. They can personalize it. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yep. Definitely. So I love that one. Good one. And then Shannon, you're gonna love this. I have one last tiny little bonus and it is a little video and it comes from Edutopia. And let me see here. Oops, where did my, do you go to their

Shannon Betts: 21:38

homepage and look at stuff or do you get like a newsletter from them? How do you find your stuff?

Mary Saghafi: 21:42

I do get a newsletter from them and they tend to send me things. So you, when you first sign up you can link some of the interests that you have. So this one has to do with literacy, and I love this. It's about a four minute video and it's. Games to amp up your reading instruction. Mm. And it has this amazing teacher who has really worked to gamify literacy and, you know, we talked about that in the last season we did. And what she is doing in her class to kind of really make sure that students are involved. So I would highly recommend that everybody is. You know, taking a look at this because I think it can spark some ideas and I love that it's in video form, so I'll just share a quick couple of examples, but basically. She uses whiteboards a lot. She'll do a dictation. So the first one she says is, everybody spells skirt. So it's pretty clear that she's been working on the IR phonics role in the second grade class. And what she'll do is have the mu have music playing while the students are doing this. They're dancing around the room and writing, and then like. She'll pause the music and say, okay, everybody put your boards up in the air. And if a student doesn't know what to do they can indicate it. She also has a policy that if you're you and you kind of see this in the video, if you don't wanna be dancing around, you don't have to, but you'll see a lot of other kids get into it, and then it's a quick show. And so it's a really fun way of making sure that students are, you know, really working through those those words that they're dictating. So, i, I really love this. So I say take a look. I think it can spark some really great ideas for literacy engagement. Awesome. Yeah,

Shannon Betts: 23:22

thanks for sharing. I'll make sure we put all those in the show notes. Yep, I sure will. So yours were kind of more practical? Mine was more, I don't know, philosophical or something, but it was, it was really helpful. Actually a family member who listens to the podcast brought this article to my attention. It was from The Atlantic and it was from back in December. And then we started talking about it in the spring because there were, response. There were a lot of letters, so many letters and response to this article that then they did like kind of a follow up. And so we were talking about the follow up first and then went back to the original December one. But the December article is called How One Woman Became the Scapegoat for America's Reading Crisis. So it's an in depth look at Lucy Calkins. And yes, I saw this headline. What happened sort of after the sold a story and mm-hmm. What led up to that and, and, and what this author did. The author was Helen Lewis. She just did a great job of getting sources, like a variety of sources. Okay. So that she sold a story is a little bit one sided, you know, and agreed. I'm usually on that side of the story, right? But like we have talked about it before and said, you know, like. We don't think Lucy really set out to be like, I'm gonna ruin kids' reading lives, you know, and like ruin generations of kids. Definitely. And the article comes from that perspective as well, you know, that like, okay, how did this happen? How did Lucy Calkins become like the fall person? Mm-hmm. For all of this, and it's, it's just, it's so well read. It's so well written. It, it talks about like the, the buildup to like the success of her company and the reading and writing project, and then how it became, you know, they said that like the philosophy became a program. And it wasn't really intentionally meant to do that, but it just sort of like they needed resources to sort of back up with the training. It started out as like PD and training for teachers and then they sort of needed that curriculum to help them. But I don't think they set out to be like, let's do this one size fits all literacy curriculum. You know, that then was like widely implemented. Mm-hmm. And she said that the thing that, they interviewed Lucy a lot for this, but she said that the thing that bothered her the most was from sold a story when they were talking about the monogram towels. You remember that part?

Mary Saghafi: 25:49

I have to say, I don't, can you remind me? I can't. So.

Shannon Betts: 25:58

Hanford was saying something about like that Lucy said they would learn from the monogram letters on their bathroom towels or something. Oh, but Lucy was saying like that she grew up, you know, not privileged and so that, that, that was one of the things that bothered her the most from the, you know.

Mary Saghafi: 26:15

Interesting. I, I hear what you're saying now. So

Shannon Betts: 26:18

yeah.

Mary Saghafi: 26:18

My assumption is that what Lucy Calkins was really trying to say is like, yeah. You know, in environmental print, students are gonna be reading things in, in different areas, and then it got really kind of skewed to more of a privileged piece of information. Is that sort of what Yeah. You just,

Shannon Betts: 26:35

yeah.

Mary Saghafi: 26:35

Okay.

Shannon Betts: 26:36

And you're just gonna have to read this article itself'cause like, I'm so glad, glad at summarizing and like, misquoting people and stuff like that, so I don't not wanna speak for her or even the author for this. But anyway, it. This, this goes into like how kind of people were like, they were Lucy or they were not Lucy, you know? Yes. And then it almost became just like a label and an argument. And it's, it's just fascinating because Lucy, Lucy also said she just always assumed people were like me and that they were weaving phonics into the program. And so that's why they sort of left it out because they weren't phonics experts, you know? But you know. And, and, and then I did, I mean, I don't. If you maybe go back to like season two when we talk about some of the balanced literacy stuff, like I think I mentioned that when I was using units of study, I watched all the training. Like there's all these DVDs that come with it. Or CD ROMs. I guess I wasn't dating myself. But anyway, there were all these like extra webinar videos that came with it and it's like Lucy and all of her trainers explaining how to use the resources and like one of'em specifically was like, this is not a script. Do not read it like a script. It's just a glimpse into how this one teacher, you can watch it start to finish as if you were there. But I had some colleagues think that they were supposed to like redeliver that exact same lesson from the, you know, that was described the same way. Interesting. And so probably in those back behind the scenes videos is information that was saying like, you know, please add in your own phonics or whatever, but yes, please add, but it was, but it was like lost in the behind the scenes stuff. And then what happens a lot of times when curriculums are adopted too, is that the district spends so much money. Buying all the resources and then just boxes and boxes arrive at the school building and then get delivered to each classroom in the midst of all that unpacking and labeling and all that stuff. There's not enough time for PD of actually how to use the things. Absolutely. And that's where a lot of the stuff gets lost in translation too. So anyway, this article, like they end up interviewing teachers that were using the resources. They, they just. They even like, they end with like, what is Lucy like still working? You know, it says she's, she's 72 years old, but she's still determined to keep fighting for her legacy. Wow. And she said, they just keep incorporating more things that they've learned into their resources and that she said she's trying to come up with a new name for her program, like Comprehensive Literacy or Rebalancing Literacy.

Mary Saghafi: 29:25

Okay.

Shannon Betts: 29:25

So,

Mary Saghafi: 29:26

yeah, I'm interested in it. I mean, here's the problem I think that, you know teachers have had, and that is there is a lot of like. Blatantly ignoring what was you know, put out in the year 2000 with the National Literacy panel. And so the best, one of the best parts I think about Lucy Calkins was that she really engaged teachers. She spoke teachers language, she got teachers really excited about teachers.

Shannon Betts: 29:55

Yeah, there was a

Mary Saghafi: 29:56

lot of like

Shannon Betts: 29:56

creativity that could be involved in like how you. Wove all the resources together, and I did love that autonomy of it. And it also really benefited a lot of the the more advanced readers in the classroom. And so we don't wanna leave all that behind. Right. Just because like her stuff was found to be like, not science of reading aligned or whatever.

Mary Saghafi: 30:20

Right. I think that, yeah, it's, it's, you know, we always say pendulum swings. Yeah. We really want to correct what was not done accurately. And specifically we're talking about three queuing. And that is not an appropriate way to teach students to use phonics to make sure that Right. We should never be promoting guessing strategies. Yeah. Yeah. So we wanna be really clear. We're like that. But I think the other piece that we even tried to include back in our season two episode when we were talking about how you know, we were a little bit more in favor of balanced literacy and phonics instruction. Exactly. Was, you know, it's the, and we wanna make sure that students are getting specifically what they need, but also you know, typically we assume positive intent from educators. And I know that like, I really want people to assume positive intent because didn't go into education trying to harm people. And I have absolutely 99 point. 9% faith that most educators go into education because they really want to. Helped students become valuable citizens. Right.

Shannon Betts: 31:35

And we don't wanna be just held to the fire for like, you know, we've talked about the students that we missed, you know? Right. And the ones that we left behind. And so why are we holding the Lucy? Because I guess because she was, you know, in the spotlight, it's like she's being held to a higher standard and not being providing grace make million.

Mary Saghafi: 31:52

When you make millions and millions of dollars, it, it really does, you know, impact you, your name and your reputation. But I think it's really interesting, I think that the title of scapegoat is mm-hmm pretty accurate and precise for a greater problem that the education world faced.

Shannon Betts: 32:09

Can I read this one list? So I told you there were like later le letters to the magazine that were sent in response to this and I, this teacher out in California. I think just echoed exactly what you said and exactly. She just sounds like she'd be a good fit for the teachers lounge to read teacher lounge'cause she echoes a lot of what we're saying. So listen, it's a pretty short letter. She says, A heartfelt thank you to Helen Lewis for her reporting on Lucy Calkins and the most recent phase of the reading wars. As a career English teacher whose mother was also a career English teacher, I've had a front row seat to the reading wars for decades. Emily Hanford sold a story podcast was particularly frustrating to me for its oversimplification of Calkins Reading Workshop, and its all too typical sidelining of teacher's. Voices wise, educators have known for a very long time. There is no one size fits all approach to reading instruction. Effective teachers combine phonics with other strategies that help develop a student's identity. As a reader, it is shocking. To none of us. The solution is both and and not either or. Louis' article was a breath of fresh air. Calkins is by no mean flawless, but her uni of study remains some of the most comprehensive and useful language arts curriculum out there in a sea of flashy, colorful nonsense. So spot on. I know, I know. I think that's definitely why, why they published that letter. She feels us or we feel her. Exactly. So the, all the letters are really great that they ended up publishing and so we'll link to that as well in our show notes.'cause I just, you, it, it was nice to see that not everybody, you know, was wanting to like burn Lucy at the stake, you know?

Mary Saghafi: 33:46

Yeah. To be clear, we're not agreeing with all of the things that she did. Yeah. She has, you know, marketed and shared, but I do think that like she's a scapegoat for a bigger problem. Okay, here's another good

Shannon Betts: 34:03

one. This is another teacher in California. I began my teaching career in 1976. I was a kindergarten teacher, trained well in my California district, and I've watched the conflicts over reading and writing instruction ever since. At some point in my teaching journey, I learned about Lucy Calkins. I loved what she had to say. I know two things are true. Lucy Calkins has been a great contributor to the knowledge of how to teach literacy, and many of us have asked too much of her. Teachers cannot take a blanket approach to teaching literacy. Luke Calkins provided many good things over her long career, even if she did not provide everything, and for that, I'm grateful. Education's administrators should be learners too, who understand the complexity of teaching reading. Shame on those who left Calkins, hanging out to dry.

Mary Saghafi: 34:46

Ooh. I love that piece too, because I feel like recently I've been really trying to advocate for administrators to have a better understanding because if you are not very well versed in a lot of these, you know, techniques when you are, you know, critiquing teachers on there. Strategies, solution oriented answers are much better than just criticism. Can I read one more'cause it's so good.

Shannon Betts: 35:13

Ooh. Yes, please. Please. Okay. This is another teacher from California. Okay. I appreciate this one's a little bit longer, but I think it just echoes it, it teaches, it speaks to exactly what you were just saying. I appreciated Heather article about Lucy Calkins'cause it added some much needed nuance. To the conversation about reading instruction in America schools. I'm a former teacher and I attend the Lucy Calkins trainings at Columbia, but I've learned a lot since then. Our education system suffers from several problems that have made it possible for flawed instructional methods to achieve wide reach. Many states and districts push teachers to adopt curricular programs with fidelity that is without ever questioning them. Even in schools where teachers have a little more freedom, they're rarely given the tools. Or the time to evaluate the quality of instructional materials themselves. I remember being handed Calkins reading curriculum in my third year of teaching and I wondered about the research that undergirded its methods, but the curriculum books didn't provide much information. I didn't know where else to look, and even if I had known where to find the facts, I didn't have time to do research on my own.'cause I just had three days to set up my own new classroom. Ask any veteran educ educator, and they will tell you that our school systems have a knack for repeating the same mistakes. I worry that the new Science of Reading movement is being co-opted by curriculum publishers, PD providers, and experts who are seeking profits by promoting a silver bullet just as they have with other invoke methods. In the past, my kids' school district just adopted a new curriculum that allegedly reflects the science of reading, but it seems like the same type of mediocre curricula that's been pedaled to big school systems for decades. If we really want research based instruction in our schools, we have to be humble about what we know and don't know about effective reading instruction. We have to be wary of anyone pushing quick fixes, and we need to teach teachers how to be critical consumers of research and users of curricula. Educators can't do this alone. We need more nuanced reporting like Lewis's so that all of us educators, parents, citizens, can better understand the problems we face and how we might solve them. Give that person a microphone. I mean like all, like all three of these that I just read aloud, I'm like getting goosebumps. Just like,'cause they just are like putting better into more eloquent words. What I'm trying to express about, you know, the nuances of like, kind of the, the problems with both ends of the extreme. It's

Mary Saghafi: 37:31

fantastic. I can't wait to dive into that, that article. Yeah, and

Shannon Betts: 37:35

I will say this is a hack. Okay. Like, you know, a lot of this is behind the paywall. And I've been getting so frustrated'cause I get like all these like suggested articles on Facebook and they're like, we think you would love this article. And it's like from some random publication and a, it's behind a paywall. It's behind a paywall. It's behind a paywall. Sure. Well, one of my friends just convinced me to like get a subscription to Apple News and it's great because it's a one monthly fee. But you, you actually. You have to get creative in the search, but you can end up finding every single one of these articles and it's like included in your Apple News subscription. Interesting. Yes. So I ended up, I was just reading this through Apple News because I couldn't read it from there. Well, we're gonna link to the Atlanta article, but if you happen to have Apple News or some other sort of like subscription to, you know. A sort of news digest kind of thing. What I end up doing is like, I'll put the name of the publication in in there and then I try to put as many words from the title exactly as they are in the search engine. Yeah. And that usually will pull up the article. Otherwise it pulls up some random things. But it usually, I can find it with some good searching.

Mary Saghafi: 38:45

Amazing. Okay. I think that that's great. I will share that the articles that I have from Edutopia and the a DD Mag are free articles. Okay, good. But you can also go in and I would absolutely recommend for both of those subscriptions. I do pay for the a DD Mag or attitude Magazine, and that is a subscription that I do have. Edutopia is a free, it's more like blog based kind of information, but the reach out that they have through the email is so great. Oh, good. So I, I usually take like one day out of the week and, and kind of just scroll through and see if there are some interesting articles and save them. Awesome. For my reading list.

Shannon Betts: 39:29

Okay. Thank you for sharing that. And I, I love talking with these articles about you and with you and I look forward to starting the new season with you soon. Season eight. Here we come. Okay. Thanks for joining us. The Reading Teachers Lounge.